Transformative Principal

Jethro Jones: Welcome to Transformative Principle, where I help you stop putting out fires and start leading.

I am your host, Jethro Jones.

You can follow me on Twitter at Jethro Jones.

Welcome to Transformative Principle.

I am.

Boy, I'm excited for this conversation today.

I've got Brent Zko on and he is the elementary principal at Mary Welsh Elementary in Williamsburg, Iowa.

He's about 650 students and then of course, like most of you principals, he does a bunch of other stuff On top of that, the district level, he a LL director, migratory education Director program.

Preschool program director and more obviously, um, we are gonna talk about how he's using ai, uh, to create curriculum for his students.

And we'll get into a bunch of other stuff too, but we're gonna start there.

So, Brent, welcome to Transformative Principal.

Thanks for being here.

Brent Zirkel: Thanks for having me on Jethro.

It's great to be here with you.

Jethro Jones: Man, I'm excited.

We were on a, another Zoom talking about, um, ai and you just nonchalantly said, oh yeah, I use AI to write curriculum.

Tell, tell me about that.

Brent Zirkel: So, um, in our building

we have teacher teams and, um, you know, there are certain content areas that are more, um, controversial, I guess you could say, at times than others.

And, um.

We've had great growth in literacy since Covid, and we've had done a lot of focus on literacy and math, but we felt at an, as an elementary that we were kind of falling behind in science and social studies.

And, um, social studies in particular seemed to be a hot and button issue, um, both politically and, um, just with concerns about, you know, people understanding what you're teaching, um, how you're teaching it.

Um, at a state level.

I don't know if.

If you've experienced this, this too.

But there were questions about, you know, are we teaching critical race theory and different things?

Is social emotional learning the same thing as critical race theory or there's just a lot of questions about that sort of thing?

So, um, we, as we were thinking about looking at a social studies curriculum, we, we talked about the importance of it being transparent so that when we, when we have this curriculum, it's not something that's in a book somewhere.

That you take off of a shelf and then people are able to view if they have questions about it.

But we want it to be out in the public eye so that our parents have a full idea of what it is that we're teaching.

They see the content and are able to, to work through that, able to have conversations with kids.

Our school board, we wanted them to be able to see that our state officials, um.

Just because we felt, um, I kind of had like a conviction actually.

I, I took, I was with a group of, uh, students that went to Washington DC and while there, um, you know, my bachelor's degree was in social sciences.

And as I'm walking around Washington, DC I'm thinking to myself, what a failure I've been as an, an individual and as a

school leader in bringing, um, like civics to life and helping kids understand and be excited about.

History and how it impacts them even today.

And so when I came back from that trip, um, that's really when I started creating.

And, um, I've been building websites for a while.

Um, as a a school teacher, I found that I. Um, yeah, I, I taught Spanish in high school and I found that if I could put my Spanish content on a website, then I had greater, um, ability to reach kids.

I had greater ability to help them practice at home.

And, um, I. What I loved as a teacher was that it always put my best work out in front of me so that whenever I came back to it, I had another iteration where I could improve upon it.

So I was always improving on my best work.

And boy, you get two or three iterations as an educator and you've got some really good stuff.

In my opinion.

I.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Well, and Brent, I want to just, uh, touch on that for a minute too, because that was how I started teaching.

Also that, uh, it's funny because I went at it from a little different way.

I hated my students coming up and saying I was absent.

What did I miss?

Then me having to like put everything together.

So I designed all of my lessons and materials so that students could do it all independently if they were absent.

Which is so silly when I think back about it now because, um, because like, it's not like I had that many kids who were absent, but it was so annoying to me that I had to make a, a change because it just drove me nuts.

But what was so good about it is exactly what you said.

I had my best stuff out in front of me.

I was intentionally designing my curriculum to be accessible to my students so that I didn't need to be there, that they could do it without me, that a parent could get on the website and check it out.

And, um, and it just, it totally changed how I taught because I, I I was making sure that things were ready for them.

My job planning wasn't done with a lesson plan.

It wasn't done until it was published on the website for kids to be able to go and access themselves, I.

Brent Zirkel: Absolutely.

And that's, and it's amazing who else is accessing it.

You know, I, I remember getting pings.

I had a buddy and he was kind of doing the same thing.

This kind of started as a, um, like a flipped classroom.

Blended classroom type of thing.

Um, and then we just kind of started using it as a tool that we used throughout the class and outside of the class.

And it was just.

Everything that we did.

Um, but you get pings from Russia and from China and people get, you know, people just

wanting to learn.

Um, and I thought that was amazing and kind of also opened me up to, to see like if we are transparent and put our best work in front of us, that you will have a global audience.

And that's powerful and also meaningful for kids, you know, if they can see that what you're putting out there, that you've got people in Russia that are so interested that they're wanting to, to learn about it or you know, from all different parts of the world, but.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

And, and what that led to for me is, uh, collaborating with people during the 2008 presidential election in the United States with people from France, the Netherlands, Australia, Belgium,
and a couple other countries that I can't remember, but collaborating all across the world about this election that was happening in the United States that everybody was interested in.

And I was an English teacher, so I wasn't even like.

That wasn't even my quote unquote content area.

But, uh, the good thing about being an English teacher is that it touches everything because it's about communication.

So, so we could, we could write about anything in that year.

We wrote about the election and did these collaborative, uh, writing assignments with kids in other countries, which was so, so cool.

Wall.

Brent Zirkel: Well, and as an educator, if you're willing to make yourself vulnerable by putting yourself out there in a, a public.

Sense like that, it also motivates you to continue to create better and better things.

And so like as I'm trying to populate my website with meaningful learning activities, then that got me into starting to create YouTube videos and making sure that it wasn't just some random person's face in front of my kids, but it was my face.

And that they saw that, oh, Mr. Circle can make a, a video.

Like he can be online.

I could be online too.

Like, it, it just creates, um, a. It switches the flip for kids in, or it flips the switch for kids in the sense that, um, so many of our kids are just consumers of technology and we need them to be producers and creators of technology.

And that's also what excites me about ai.

go back to your original question,

like how are we using it?

We're we're using it.

We're creating a, a website.

It's called uh, raider social studies.com.

And on that website we are creating units.

We've, we've worked as teams to identify like what are our priority standards, and then we've built proficiency scales, um, of how we'll assess those priority standards.

And then we're working to create learning activities that we put, um, on the website for kids.

And we use AI to create some of those learning activities.

Um.

And, you know, at different grade levels it looks very different.

I work in a three-year-old preschool through sixth grade building, and in kindergarten, what they have on their website looks very different than in sixth grade.

Um, but it's exciting, you know, like for me, I, I know a lot about social studies.

It was my, my background.

Um, but sometimes AI makes it easier to organize your thoughts and, and put it in a, um, consistent, um.

Whether it's chronological or thematic or however you want it to do, um, AI can be assistive in that we use chat GPT for that at times.

Sometimes it's just to be able to draw out details and then to be able to sift.

You know, with ai, I like to think of that 80 20 rule where, you know, we'll put in our prompts and ask, you know, for, for information back, but then we're gonna take and make sure that 20% of what we're doing is our own work.

We're gonna edit it, we're gonna pare it down.

A lot of times what we do is we're, we're changing the lexile level so it's accessible at different levels, um, for students.

And again, you can use AI for, for that.

Um.

One of the, the things that I'm really proud of here recently is we created a Middle East unit and, um, geopolitics was one of my favorite things in, in college, and, um, just makes me understand the world in a different way.

And we talked a lot about, um, we call 'em bad actors in geopolitics.

So, um, you can take.

Different people and look at the choices that they made and the situations they were in, and determine whether they're acting in good faith to help improve life for the people they were serving as leaders or whether they were doing things, you know, to benefit themselves.

And so, um, we created an activity of claims and counterclaims using ai.

And, you know, we used AI to generate a list of, of 14 different people in the Middle East over the last, you know, 25 years.

And what were some of the things that could be considered, um.

Claims that they were bad actors, and then what were things that were, would be counterclaim that would show good things that they did.

So you're showing like a fuller aspect of people in history, um, so that the kids then are reading through it and they're making the choices of whether they believe someone was a bad actor or not, and then justifying their thoughts behind it.

So, um, it's, it's, what I love about it is, you know, just earlier this week I went into the lunchroom and I was talking with some of our sixth graders.

And one of our sixth grade boys, um, at the table called me over and wanted to talk to me about, um, AAD from Syria.

And he wanted me to know that, um, because we made this a few months ago, that now it was outdated and that we, uh, we need to, um, you know.

Fix that.

And, but just to be able to have a conversation with a sixth grader about Syria and Alad and some of the decisions, um, that got him, you know, into power, what he did to maintain power, and then now why he's out of power.

Like, talk about powerful conversations with kids.

Jethro Jones: That the kids are not too young for either.

That's.

Brent Zirkel: absolutely not.

Jethro Jones: That's the amazing thing is that we, we think we need to put on kid gloves and not talk to them about what's really going on.

But the reality is there are kids their age who are living through this and we have an opportunity to, to talk about it.

And like, what I, what I love about this thing that you've created is that it's all accessible for parents to go in and see.

And so they can go say.

Well, I don't agree with this.

And then they can say why they don't.

But then you also have, like, here it all is out there.

Like we're not hiding anything.

So you can go see and you can, you can leave your, your comments and opinions and that's totally fine.

Um, but at least it's out there, you know, and it's not hidden in a book on a shelf or in some curriculum document that's behind a password.

Like, I can go on there and see all these things that you were just talking about and see where they're at and, and what it all looks like.

Brent Zirkel: Well, and, and just even with the lesson itself, it's all about claims and counterclaims, so it's not like there's a right answer.

It's the answer is complex.

And so we're getting kids to think.

At, at higher levels rather than memorize and regurgitate.

And I think that that's what's powerful.

And, and I love this Middle East unit just in that, you know, like our kids today, they weren't alive for nine 11.

They, they, they're trying to understand the world that they're, that they're living in.

And there are so many pieces, you know, we, we actually start the unit talking about, um, the three religions of the Middle East and just a general overview of what those religions are.

There's similarities and differences.

Um, then we go into like the creation of the state of Israel and how that came about, and then why there have been difficult feelings on different sides about that.

Um, and then that brings us up into more of the modern day.

Um, you know, the kids do learn about nine 11.

We feel like as a district, um, that's a really important thing.

And that was one of those things from Washington DC that trip where I just felt like there were certain things in history, like the Holocaust nine 11, like I felt ashamed if our kids did not leave our elementary building.

Having some sort of understanding about it, and if we could do it at a deeper level, even better.

Um, so, so yeah, it's kind of a place, it's a, a websites become a storehouse of, of information that kids can then manipulate.

You can have conversations.

That whole idea of the shift in common core years ago was that we're not getting kids to memorize a certain piece of information.

We're getting them to take a stance and then be able to justify through evidence and reasoning why that is a correct stance and.

That's the world we live in.

You know, like we're, we're doing that on a daily basis.

So I just love how it mimics and, and creates, um.

Those skills and like the communication skills that you were talking about too, the, because kids are, kids are not only studying that in social studies, but then they're writing about it in their, um, literacy courses.

They're speaking it.

Um, so they, they're having like some debates.

Um, so they're getting up and publicly like taking a stance and, and hearing pros and cons against that and then responding like, these are all really valuable skills for kids.

Jethro Jones: So the thing that I really like about this is that you're creating a, a hyper localized curriculum basically, that is specific.

Specifically for your students.

Now, in the past, this would be too big of a lift because the, the writing needed to be done by your teachers, and now with AI you have the ability to use sources that are out there.

You have, you can put a source into the AI and do all that stuff.

Talk to me about that philosophical approach of you creating this specifically for your.

For your, for your community because anybody can come and like use this and have it work for theirs also.

This is specifically with your kids in mind, your background, the things that you think are important with the teachers.

So like you guys are really focusing on this is what we want, and you have Iowa State standards and you have the district, you know, things that you need to do, but this is really custom tailored for your specific school and not necessarily something that you could just take out and put in.

You know, I'm in Spokane, Washington and just put in the Spokane Washington district and say, here's the same thing.

Why is that important specifically to you guys?

I.

Brent Zirkel: Well, I think, you know, we live in a, um, traditional rural community.

Um, it's a great place to be.

It's a great place to, to raise a family.

Um, and like American values are super important to our community, like patriotism is, is very important.

Like Veterans Day, um, you know, there's flags all over in the the square.

There's things that kids, um, are doing, um, within the community to honor veterans and, um.

There's just, there is that like American value.

That's really important to us.

And I think when we can arm our educators, um, with good content, um, then you have really interesting and deep discussions that they, they also want to have.

That was one of the things I thought was really cool was, um, the feedback that I've got from the, the teachers.

Um.

So far has all been very positive in that they felt like they were learning along with the kids because, you know, as they're putting things into AI as prompts to get information back and
then coming back and, and having to filter that and, um, work through what is like most important to be able to present it, they're learning along the way and at, at an elementary level.

You know, I came from the secondary world and you know, like we're all content masters in the secondary world and really deep into our content.

The elementary, you've got teachers that are teaching four different content areas that are very different, and a thing like history is so expansive, right?

Like, like you can't, like even knowing what to teach.

Was really difficult.

And so that's why going through that process of prioritizing first, um, what to teach and what's nice about our standards is our standards are all about skills, not about content.

So it's not like a certain time of, of, of history or anything like that.

So you could match any time of history to.

The, the skills that you're trying to develop.

Um, but it's, it's unique locally, um, in that there are, you know, kids are meeting other people in our community, right?

Like other adults in our community, they're hearing from them, like, um, you know, like nine 11 is a great example of that as they're learning about the Middle East.

Like what was their experience during nine 11?

Um, how was that different from their parents' experiences?

And so they're able to have conversations.

With, with each other as students, with their parents, with the community at large, and then with, with other people that are within the community.

And I think that that just creates, um, you know, it creates deeper thinking.

It, it helps people think from different viewpoints and be able to value other people's viewpoints.

And, um, just see that, um.

There might not always be a right answer.

That's what I love about the bad actors is there is not a right answer.

The answer is what you can justify and feel that you can stand behind because you have evidence to support it.

And sometimes that's the best we can do in this world.

You know, I think that sometimes we try to teach everybody things are black and white and you know, I, I believe that we live in a pretty gray world

in a lot of ways.

Jethro Jones: Yeah, for sure.

We really do.

And you said something I think is really key there, that this essentially gives teachers an opportunity to have these light bulb moments with kids, you know?

And in every interview I had with a teacher, like, why did you wanna become a teacher?

Well, I'm looking for that light bulb moment with a kid.

That is almost always what they say.

And.

Pretty much every teacher wants that to happen.

And the challenge is that that is not always easy to do when you're teaching a standard curriculum.

But when you do things a little bit differently, like what you're doing with social studies, uh, like what I did with student driven learning and personalized learning, those light bulb moments happen nearly every day.

And that's powerful because you're not gonna get a light bulb moment from a scripted lesson.

Okay.

Maybe you will, but.

It's gonna be pretty few and far between because there's not really room for the light bulb moments and because everything is so personal, all learning is personal to each individual student.

A student is going to have a connection that you may not have even noticed, could be a possibility, but when you bring something in and you're like, here's this example of how they're a bad actor, they're like, oh.

I know a story about this.

Here's what my dad told me when I was three years old about this guy who lived down the street, and now I understand why that guy was a bad actor.

And it's like, whoa, that's amazing because you're in fourth grade and you remembered this story from when you were three, and now you understand what a bad actor means in a way that is deep and personalized to you.

That kind of stuff is really powerful and so much fun to do when you're a teacher and.

You just enjoy life so much more, right?

Brent Zirkel: Well, I think that, like you touched on something too that I've heard as feedback from our teachers so far is that there feels like there's a greater freedom.

In the discussion point because it's a discussion, so there's, there's give and take and it's unique.

Depending on which group you're in, um, it's unique, um, due to the background that different students are bringing in.

I mean, you have some students that will bring in a lot of background knowledge, and then you have others that have very little.

And so the questioning also becomes more authentic because, you know, you have peer to peer questioning that's happening rather than the teacher saying like, this is what happened and this is what you need to know for a test.

So it, it really is.

Um.

Learning through dialogue, and that's, um, you know, all progress happens through dialogue.

Jethro Jones: So let's get into the, the nitty gritty of how you're using, um, AI to help you with this because it.

It is so difficult to write curriculum and people who love it, like they're just a special breed, right?

And, and to, to be able to create all of this from scratch is, is a really big lift.

So talk about the specific things that you have used AI for and that you currently use AI for.

Like you used AI to create some of these things and then you use AI through the process.

With teachers and kids like as they're teaching it.

So talk about those two aspects.

Anything else that I didn't ask?

Brent Zirkel: Yeah, so, um, I call it layering.

I don't know if that's the technical term or not.

But, um, layering for me is when you're using multiple technologies to create something that wouldn't be possible with anyone individually.

And that's what we do with AI, is we might use multiple different AI platforms to create things or to bring things together, and then we use the website, um, as a way to store those pieces.

Um.

So chat, GPT is is a big one that we've used.

Um, I know that's one of the very simple ones, but the thing I love about chat GPT is the images that it will produce are amazing.

Like, I'm not an artist.

Um, I, I do know my social studies content, but I cannot create art around social studies.

So I can go into chat GPT and, and ask it to create abstract.

Representations of different concepts and what it comes back with.

I, it is just stunning to me and I love that, that like there's no copyright to that.

I, I can use that art and, and put it on the website and, and that in itself.

Creates a lot of dialogue with kids, you know, like it is observational dialogue of like, well, what do you see here?

What do you think that means?

Why, why do you, why is this image or this symbol in it?

Um, so it, it allows you to, to draw a lot, um, that way.

Um, I. Uh, one of the AI platforms that I really love is, uh, SUNO ai, and it allows you to create music, um, with, um, you know, we, like, we can use vocabulary terms, um, we can use, um, a concept and describe the concept, but, um, I love rap and so, um, I think a lot of our kids do too.

And so we'll create wraps.

About, um, you know, different concepts and then that, that goes on the website and that becomes like a, a memory tool to help kids learn and maintain vocabulary because as they learn the
rap, um, and you can do, you know, we do that not only for social studies, we do that sometimes with social stories and things like that, but, um, you know, the human brain is built still.

Like we're living in a, uh, beyond information, age, tech, you know.

Era, but our brains are still built for tribal life.

And so like having, having the chance and the, the rhythm and all that stuff like that all gets the brain working and encoding in a way that's powerful for kids.

Um, then we'll use, you know, I, I use things like magic school.

Um, at times I look at that as kind of like a gateway ai, um, platform for educators.

Where we'll, um, maybe use that to develop hooks or like lesson starters, um, for kids.

Um, we'll use it to get ideas at times.

You know, like, um, they have a thing in, um, magic school that's called, um, make it Relevant.

And so you can put in concepts and it'll give you different ways or different ideas to make it relevant.

And I look at AI for educators as.

Thought partners.

So AI shouldn't be doing your work for you.

It should be making your work more efficient in how you're doing it, saving you time and energy.

Um, but it should be a thought partner so that, you know, you're putting, you're putting things in and then you're taking 'em out and you're adjusting them, um, knowing because you know the students that are in front of you, so you know what you need to do to adjust it, to make it most effective for the kids that are in front of you.

Um, so, you know, I do have some people I, you know, that, that think like, oh, I just typed something and AI's gonna create all this for me.

And I'm like.

Man, that that's, that robs you of the experience because the, the beauty is that when you get to become the creator and you get to do something with it, the AI is just organizing all of it.

So you got it in front of you, and then you can create from what you have in front of you that way.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Yeah.

The way that I like to describe that is that.

Uh, the AI becomes the, uh, the assistant who does the menial work for you.

You know, AI is really good at doing anything that you ask it to.

It can do it, but it's really hard to get it to do the exact thing that you want it to do.

And so I often use several different AI tools to like use one to generate a prompt and another one to implement that prompt.

Um, and, and different things like that because there are different ways to, uh, to make it happen that that is beneficial.

I. That one AI tool can do better than another.

And, and that's the thing that I love, is I can, I can take something from over here, make it work in a way I want it to over on this side, and then it, I get the thing that I actually wanted out of the project.

Brent Zirkel: And that's what I call the layering process, right?

And

so, you know, like we use Google Suites in our school, and so a lot of times we'll take the pieces that we've, we've learned or gained, um, from ai and we'll drop those in a Google slide just so that we have something sequential.

Um, that's, that's, um.

Familiar to teachers that they can feel comfortable with.

But, but there were lots of different stages in between of pulling that together to put it, um, in the way that we have it presented.

Like whether it's it's in, with the activity, whether it's in the, um, the reading or the images that kids are seeing, but we're, we're taking it all and curating it within a Google slide a lot

of times.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Brent Zirkel: you can also use AI for assessments.

Um, that's been very helpful too.

Um, you know, we always try to start with the end in mind.

So, you know, we have our priority standard, we have our proficiency scales of how we're gonna measure, and then we try to have assessments that accurately are gonna measure it.

Um, so, you know, we, we we use AI or AI can be used in all of those aspects.

I think the important thing to remember with AI and technology in general is we also don't want kids on screens all day.

Jethro Jones: Mm-hmm.

Brent Zirkel: We, we wanna limit that.

And so we try to use AI to curate the, the best stuff, get it all together in one spot so kids can go and access it there.

And then they're gonna use that in, in conversation, in pairing, you know, partner activities, different things.

So it's not like they're on the screen.

Doing their learning, they're taking what they've seen in the screen or what they're, they've gained in the video or whatever it might be.

And then they're gonna use that in communication with one another.

And I think that's where sometimes educators are afraid, like, oh, AI is gonna take our job, or any, you know,

are always gonna be the foundation of everything that we do in education.

Teachers are only gonna become more and more important as we use AI because they're gonna be the ones that take it, curate it, to then allow kids to go back and have real world experiences with it, either within the classroom or outside of the classroom.

Uh.

Jethro Jones: So if, if, if education is just about dispensing knowledge.

Like we don't really need teachers because the AI and technology can do that already.

But a education is not about just dispensing knowledge.

It's about teaching kids how to be adults.

And so that's the key where we really need to have good hearted.

Responsible, appropriate adults helping kids learn how to be adults themselves.

And it starts at a very young age.

I've, I've been in some men's groups, uh, recently where I've had the opportunity to talk to young fathers about how to get their kids to turn out good when they're, you know, ready to leave the house.

And that's not something that starts when.

They are 16 and you're like, okay, time to get serious about you leaving the house.

No, that starts when they're born and it starts with the things you start doing.

And sometimes you screw up and you teach 'em something bad, whether intentionally or unintentionally, and that sucks, but it happens and so, so you've got to constantly be thinking, how do we help them be the kind of adults that we want them to be?

Who can make good decisions?

Who can look at a situation and say.

He, for example, here's a bad actor.

This person's not acting right.

And I need to, to make sure that I understand that and see that, and know that I'm not gonna fall into that trap that they're laying for me.

Brent Zirkel: Yeah, there's life lessons to be learned along the way with the content and skills.

That you're developing, right?

And that's, that's part of the most fun of it.

And then as teachers, you get to be, um, kind of like the guide along the way.

You get to be the one that, that, you know, as they ask this question, well, you know, let me give you this and have you think about this and let's come back and have a conversation once you've got a little bit more information or a bigger picture of what you maybe originally thought this, this could be.

Um, but kids, all along the way.

Can learn and can have those conversations.

I, I kinda like what you said earlier about, um, you know, they're ready for these conversations.

It's, it's us sometimes as adults that are not, um, ready or prepared or think that they, they can handle it.

Jethro Jones: Yeah, absolutely.

So there's a lot more that we can talk about.

We didn't even get to your test kitchen educational foundation that we should have a whole separate episode on because that is so cool.

So I'm gonna have you come back on the program and, and talk about that.

Um, but my last question is, what is one thing that a principal can do this week to be a Transformative Principal like you, Brent.

Brent Zirkel: Well, that's quite a compliment.

I, I try to be as good as I can be.

I, I grew up with the phrase, good, better, best, never let it rest until you're good.

As your better and your better is your best.

So.

Jethro Jones: That's awesome.

Brent Zirkel: every day I think about what is the next step that I can take, and I think to be a Transformative Principal, that's what, that's a mindset that you need to have, is you might not be able to accomplish all of this in the next week, but you can take your first step.

I. Towards accomplishing it.

And the, the biggest, um, obstacle I think right now if we're talking about AI in general is, um, not with kids.

It's with adults helping adults understand it.

Helping adults not feel, um, a fear of it, but helping adults see that it's a tool that will help them be more effective eventually.

And so, you know, it could be as simple as, um.

Having a, a kind challenge with your, your faculty about usage of it.

It could be as simple as modeling, um, and being vulnerable.

Um, there, there have been times where we come into our collaborative meetings and I don't know the answer to something, and so I said, you know what?

Let's just see what AI has to say about this.

And then we jump in and, and, and we do it together.

We practice different prompts and, and then we see what comes back and, and we move forward from that.

So it's, it's an openness to it and it's, um, working to, you know, so much is coming out so quickly and you're not gonna be able to do everything but find where your passion is and, and what you believe could benefit kids and just take a step in that direction.

And that would be my advice.

Jethro Jones: Yeah, that's awesome.

And I. Love that phrase.

Good, better, best, never let it rest till your good is better and your better is your best.

Did I get that right,

Brent Zirkel: Pretty close.

Jethro Jones: man?

All right.

I'll take it good enough.

Brent Zirkel: That was impressive.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Um, all right, well, this was awesome.

We're definitely gonna have you back.

Just a reminder, if you're listening to this and you're interested in AI stuff, I do these AI leader office hours every month on the third Tuesday of the month at 1:00 PM Pacific.

That was how Brent and I got connected.

He showed up to one of those and we made it happen.

So if you want more info about that.

Uh, go to ai leader.info and you can, you can register to be part of that.

Um, and that's fun because we just go and nerd out about cool AI stuff that we're trying out.

And, and after Brent showed up there, I was like, well, you gotta come on the podcast.

We gotta talk about this more.

So, um, so Brent, this was awesome.

Is there a way you want people to connect with you or reach out to you?

Brent Zirkel: You know, I, I can be reached out.

I don't do a lot of social media as a administrator, um, just to keep my own sanity.

Jethro Jones: Yeah.

Brent Zirkel: Um, but you can always reach me at my email.

It is just my name, Brent, uh, B-R-E-N-T dot z. gmail.com and, um, that's my personal email and I'm, I'm happy to reach out.

It's been a pleasure to be with you, Jethro.

I find you fascinating.

I learn every time I'm with you.

Um, last, you know, when I came to the office hours, um, you shared, um, an AI platform with me that I've already used and have, have shared with other educators.

And, um, so take that first step.

You know, it's alright to be vulnerable.

We're gonna do, we're gonna make mistakes, but we're gonna grow from it.

And it's the growth, my, my motto is progress through struggle.

If you, if you run from the struggle, you're not gonna get better.

So embrace the struggle and let's move on.

Jethro Jones: Man.

Good stuff.

Brent, this was awesome.

Thanks so much for being part of Transformative principle today.

Brent Zirkel: My pleasure.