Transformative Principal

Welcome to Transformative Principal, where I help you stop putting out fires and start leading.

I'm your host, Jethro Jones.

You can follow me on Twitter at Jethro Jones.

Okay.

Welcome to Transformative Principle.

Great to have you here today.

Uh, I, we are continuing the reject the premise work that Danny and I have been working on for a few weeks.

This is reject the premise number six, and you can find the even ones on Transformative principle and the odd ones on Danny's podcast.

Better Leaders, better Schools.

Danny, good morning my friend.

Good morning, my friend, Jethro.

How are you?

I am great.

It is good to see you.

Um,

Yeah.

Good to see you

for people who don't know, what we've been doing is we wrote this book together and uh, and then we stopped and so then we decided we wanted to still do something with all the, all the work that we had done, and so we are.

Just slowly going through all of our ideas about rejecting the premise that exists.

And there are a couple ways that if you are listening and you think this is great and you're loving the series, you can, uh, connect with either one of us and say, Hey, I want to help and we got stuff for you to do.

Uh, it could be doing some AI work to turn into the actual book that could be, um, reviewing what we've done already and saying, here's some things you're missing.

Here are some premises that need rejecting, stuff like that.

So if you are enjoying it, please reach out and say, Hey, I want to be involved in this.

We'd love to have you.

And think that, uh, the more the merrier that has been.

Danny and I, we've believed that for our whole time we've known each other.

Uh, the, there's always more room to share and grow and do things.

So, um, so we've done five episodes of this already, and this is number six.

I'm excited about this stuff because this is fun to talk about and I'm, I'm personally really enjoying it.

So, uh, anything else you wanna say is a preamble, Danny?

No, I don't think so.

You covered it all.

It's just, uh, this has been been a fun way to, you know, discuss the ideas and, uh, stay connected and provide value, you know, for people that tune in.

So, I'm ready to rock and roll.

So we are gonna start today with this premise that parents partner with the school and, uh, this one, there's nuance to it, and this is why I think that it's so important.

The reality is, is that schools should partner with parents because parents have the initial and ultimate responsibility for educating their children.

And the school just steps in to help that.

And I was talking with a bunch of principals one time and one principal said, uh, there's no accountability for parents if they screw up.

I literally laughed out loud because I could not believe that he said that.

And I asked him what kind of accountability he had as a school leader, because there are lots of schools that really stink.

There are lots of, uh, kids that are failing that are not successful when they get outta school and where's the accountability for schools?

And he said, well, the state could come in.

And, and take over my school.

And I said, if that happens, what?

What is the worst possible case scenario that happens there?

Half your teachers could leave, they could be forced out, and they bring in new people, but they still have jobs.

They don't lose their jobs completely, they just have to go to another school.

And then I asked him what the accountability was for parents and he said, well, there is none.

And I said, look, if your kid is still living at your house and not being a productive member of society when they're 30 years old.

That's some pretty big accountability.

You as the parent have to deal with that for the rest of that kid's life.

And so if you screw up as a parent early on, you feel those repercussions for the rest of the kid's life.

And, and so it is very important that we understand that parents are the real teachers of kids and we just step in to help with that.

And so schools are not the.

The be all and end all written, it comes to education.

They're simply a support because so much of what kids learn, they learn in their home first and last.

Hmm.

You know, uh, Seth Godin wrote that book, stop Stealing Dreams.

And, and that one inspired me to write my first book, the Better Leaders, better Schools Roadmap.

a lot of people, you know, they, they, they miss the nuance and I think it's just 'cause uh, you know, they don't read past the punchline, you know, or headline, You know, Seth is criticizing some of the stuff that schools do and, and you know, his critique is, we've heard it before, right?

In terms of like the factory model and it hasn't changed, and da, da da.

you know, at least something that I appreciate about him is he invites the reader to think about what the solution is, right?

And give some, uh, prompts and some, um, uh, questions to, to facilitate that.

Because just critiquing without solutions, you know, is like.

A waste of everybody's time.

But the thing that a lot of folks miss that I really appreciate about Seth, is he said, even though I'm, you know, I'm criticizing, maybe the lack of within schools, right?

And adapting to the, the modern context, um, he said, you.

not all their fault.

And the kid's first education starts with me at

Mm-hmm.

So every parent needs to, and, and should take that responsibility.

And I think most do, you know, some don't.

Oh, well there's no, uh, certificate or class to, to pass in order to have kids.

That just happens, right?

um, that's the thing.

You know, and, and maybe that should take some of the pressure off as well for, uh, school leaders realizing, know, um, we're not the main source of education.

We are a partner with the main source of education, which is the parent, right?

And how can we come alongside, you know, what families are trying to accomplish with their kids, um, to best support their dreams?

So in, in that spirit, couple things that.

In the past that have worked well, you know, one, uh, I remember with, with, with, um, with parents coming into high school, our admissions.

Director ran a wonderful activity, which was just like, what are your hopes, dreams, and aspirations for your kids, right?

parents wrote that down on note cards, which we kept.

And then we would follow up with parents on like, how's progress going on this?

Right?

You sent little Jethro to our campus.

Here's, here's what you hope, dream, you know, for, for him.

And, uh.

How's it going and how can we help?

Right.

And parents loved that activity.

They loved that we actually did the activity and referred back to it too, which is, a leadership, no-no.

That so many principals do, they do an activity.

It seems fun.

People get excited and then what?

Still waiting.

Yep.

Crickets.

So crickets.

So that, that's cool.

You know, following up.

Then another, uh, another idea that I'll just share here to add a little more value.

Um, Susie Wise, who wrote, uh, design for Belonging out of the Stanford, uh, D School, she joined me on the show.

Did, did, did she come on yours too.

She did.

Yep.

Yeah.

So, you know, if you checked out that book, Jethro, if you remember that she had one activity with parents and essentially, um.

During the open house, something like that.

She had a a, like basically a massive T chart or two pieces of chart paper and just on one was an invitation.

You know, here's something I can teach within the community as a parent.

Right.

Uh.

A very simple example, maybe I would put on there.

Do you wanna start a podcast?

I could teach you that, right?

I could teach you how to write a book.

I could teach you the art of storytelling.

There's a lot I could teach.

I could teach you how to have beautiful locks of hair, right?

And uh, and if you don't feel like doing your hair, you wear a hat, right?

I could teach you that art in, you know, wardrobe.

Cozy hoodie, you

There you go.

anyways, uh, and then the other, the other chart was, um, here's what I, I'd like to learn, you know, and then they, there's played matchmaker, right?

Uh, in terms of like who could teach what and what did parents wanna learn?

And again, this is the school partnering with parents that didn't necessarily even have to do anything with the students, it had to do with the parents and.

The last piece of this little anecdote, um, I remember her telling me about a, a, a mechanic who's like, well, you know, um.

Uh, people wanna learn like oil changes.

I could teach oil changes.

And he, he was really discounting that as a skill that would be interesting and, uh, beneficial to the community.

And it was one of the most popular classes within the school because there were a lot of, um, moms and maybe single moms too, who just wanted to, to know that, right.

And not have to rely on a mechanic or a guy or whatever to, you know, change the oil of a car.

Um, and so.

Yeah.

You know, don't discount anything you can do.

And how, how do you partner sort of with parents?

Um, to, to connect with like where they're going and how you can help them.

You do those kind of things, you know, then your school's gonna be a, a space where people wanna be a part of it.

'cause what you're doing is always adding value, you know, to people's lives.

So I think the last distinction is that's an active service.

It's not, you have to come here and we're the experts and we know everything, and you listen to us while we shake our finger.

we're gonna shake our other

Yeah.

you for all the reasons you know, that you suck as a parent and an adult.

It's like, no, you know, you're, you, you're turning that power dynamic around, uh, and it really works.

So anything you wanna

Uh.

add to that buddy?

It's like a superpower really, because when you, when you start saying, how can we serve you and help you meet your goals, to be honest, they probably don't even have an answer.

But the fact that you ask makes them think, maybe I can ask them for something else, and then they feel like they can.

And so we have all these systems and processes in schools to help with wraparound services.

And if you're in a Title one school, then you have to do a parent engagement plan and have parent involvement.

And all that.

And, and that's all looking at it backwards.

We really need to be saying parents, how do we serve you in the best way possible?

And this is especially important now because after COVID, so many parents realized that the school is not meeting their needs in one of several different ways.

And so micro schools have come along.

Homeschool homeschooling has become some such a bigger deal.

Charter schools have been around and will continue to be around.

More states have passed laws and are passing laws about, uh, giving funding to parents like that is just going to continue to happen.

And the schools that are gonna be successful, public, private, or otherwise, are going to be the ones that serve parents and help them with what they need to happen with their kids, not the ones that are our neighborhood schools that we have to go to because we live in the neighborhood.

That time is now in the past.

And so if you want your school to stay up with enrollment and keep kids coming, you have to actually serve the people that are there and not just do your own thing and assume that everybody's gonna buy into it because they're not.

Yeah, that's good.

Thanks.

Chat through.

All right.

So the next one is, uh, the premise is test scores are everything.

And we reject that and say that we should instead of focusing on.

Things that we get information about later.

We focus on the inputs and we measure what matters.

So what do you wanna say about this one, Danny?

You know?

Yeah.

It's certainly not the only way to measure school success and um.

You know, something I really liked, uh, when I was working in this district down in Houston, uh, the leadership would often say, you know, this is just a, a snapshot of one moment in time, right?

And they were right.

That was one thing they did really well was com communicate that piece.

And of course, you want to do well, sort of in public facing, uh, metrics that you're held accountable to.

but just understand that it's not, it's not the only thing.

other problem with like, sort of this test taking, um, culture and focus, right?

It, it certainly, uh, creates this environment that we don't like, which is when students are always asking, is this on the test?

Is this on the test?

what they're asking is, do I need to pay attention?

Right?

Or do I need to kind of maybe pay attention because I could be potentially tested on this in the future, and so they're trying to quickly sort through.

Yeah, meaning and not meaning.

told this story on the podcast before.

I don't know about this one, but you know, I went and spoke to a thousand school leaders in Mombasa, Kenya.

And they had a student panel and one of the, uh, students said, you know, I, I wouldn't use AI if the teacher told me, like, why this work mattered.

Right.

If I understood the purpose of what we were doing.

And so basically said another way, I use AI to get my work done fast.

If I, if I don't see the relevance.

this task in my life.

And so, you know, we, we have to be, connecting the dots, so to speak, and showing the relevance and maybe not maybe, and absolutely adjusting our lessons and what we teach students and, and, and what they experience.

You do that and you hook them because they're like, oh, I see this in my life.

This makes, makes it better for me.

Um, and plus, we know.

That there's actually, uh, biases and tests too, that sort of test, like kind of maybe, um, cultural knowledge and experience and might center one group versus another.

Uh, but I'll never forget, I, I really wish I remembered what book.

Oh, I was talking to Ted, Ted Dinner Smith, uh, big venture capitalist, and he did, uh, you know what school could be.

He's got a cool new book out called Aftermath and a new documentary.

Called, um, multiple choice, which everybody should definitely check out.

Uh, but he, he, he was, he was looking at, um, yeah, standardized tests and how this one question actually, affluent white students all seemed to get wrong, but poorer students of color were all rocking and like investigated what was going on there.

to do with, um, tips, right?

Working in restaurants, uh, or in other jobs that, that work for tips and, um, yeah, like why did, why did kids in a lower economic sort of status crush this one question?

Because it was relevant to, um, survival in how their families generated income, right?

Whereas, uh, the students, you know, that were more affluent.

They didn't really think about tips very much 'cause it wasn't a part of their experience.

Right.

So that's interesting.

'cause that's, that's usually not how you think of, um, bias on standardized tests, but it just showed, you know, if you're talking about somebody's experience and what they, uh.

What, what they, yeah.

See day to day.

Um, it, it had nothing to do with intelligence.

It had to do with more of exposure, right?

So, uh, yeah.

Tests are definitely not the only way to measure success.

And the last thing I'll add, you know, that's why I did the play Your game program, right?

Because I, I often tell Ruckus makers, if you can't tell me the rules by which you know, you're winning the great school leadership game.

Then do you understand you're playing by somebody else's rules, whether that's the state, the government, uh, the district or whatever.

But you're not, you're not operating autonomously and operating outta your strengths and gifts.

You're playing somebody else's game, right?

And so standardized tests, that's somebody else's game, which you have to understand.

And what I invite ruckus makers to do is invent the scorecard.

For which you wanna be measured as successful or unsuccessful, and then do that game really, really well.

Yeah, and a lot of that stuff can be focusing on the inputs and focusing on the things that you can control and what you can do.

And so for example, if you want to make sure that every kid.

Is known and cared about and has a positive adult, then you make sure that everybody knows more than just the kids in their classes and that you provide opportunities during the day to make sure that kids have chances to interact positively and appropriately with good adults in their lives.

Those kinds of things really matter.

And uh, I was interviewing, uh, Eric McKey, who is a principal in Wyoming who's awesome.

And he.

Did that thing where they put a little dot on all the kids that they were the positive adult for, and then they asked the kids in a survey and they said, Hey, do you have a positive adult?

And while the teachers said they thought 95% of the students did, the students answered that only like a third of them had a positive adult that they could go to at the school.

Wow.

they flipped that and started focusing on the kids.

Kept asking the kids, do you have a positive adult?

And when the kids identified that they didn't.

Then they made sure that they, uh, did things to make it happen where they gave kids opportunities to be involved in sports or activities or clubs or whatever it is, and they got those kids involved so that later the kids could say, yes, I do have someone.

And eventually they got to, 99% of their students had a positive adult.

And that's a lot different than the kids saying only a third did.

When the teachers were like, oh yeah, we're doing a great job.

I mean, that kind of stuff happens all the time.

So you gotta look at what the kids are actually experiencing rather than just what you think they're experiencing.

You.

You also mentioned that kids would not use AI if they, if they had meaning or relevance to the work.

And the thing is that our, our system has been perfectly designed for AI to do all of the work for us, all of the assignments and tests and everything.

Is all set up to be an end product, an end result that's very easily copyable because that makes it easier to grade and it's all the same.

And so our system has been designed for cheating for a long time.

And because that's, that's because we focus on the wrong things.

And if we focus on the process instead of the product itself.

We would have a better chance of being able to intervene and, and help kids actually learn, uh, all along the way.

Um, a couple other things that I just wanted to, to say is if you play your role effectively, then the rest is gonna take care of itself.

And if you, it's that, uh, that old, um, what's his name?

John Walsh.

Steve Walsh.

I can't remember.

A coach of the four nine ERs who said the points will take care of themself.

And

Hmm.

you know, if you just do your assignment and do your job and you run the play how you're supposed to run it, then the points will take care of themself and we don't even need to worry about that.

Now that's really easy to say when you're winning all the time because that's what happens.

But you have to have that belief before that, and you have to be working on those things before that to really see it come to be.

And.

Anytime somebody who is successful or a winner says something, it's like, yeah, that's easy for you to say.

But the reality is anybody can say that starting today, today, this is how I'm gonna live my life today.

This is how I'm gonna leave my school today.

This is how we're gonna interact.

And that's what, what makes it matter.

Uh, one of the things that will really help with this is having systems in place to make it so that you don't have to think about these things as much.

You don't have to like.

Make a special point to do it because you have systems that support all of these positive inputs that support the things that you're trying to do, so that it's not just you, uh, run around like a chicken with your head cut off trying to make it all work, but that these things are almost automatic.

And that's a place where AI and automation can actually be really beneficial.

You know, if you know that well, let me give an explanation, uh, an example from.

Years ago, this was 2000, when was this?

2012. Um, we had a bunch of behavior problems at my Title one school, and we needed to communicate with parents and we needed to communicate with teachers and we needed the kids to understand where they were at.

And it seemed like everything we were doing was just like a bunch of busy work and wasn't really working.

And we figured out how to take the student tracker where the kids got rated by their teachers every day.

So they got immediate feedback at the end of their period and knew what was going on and how they were behaving.

And then they would come to the office, get a little stamp on that, and we would put it through a scanner.

That scanner would read the student's ID number, and then it would send an email to the parent so that by the time the kid got out to the car, the parent already had an email saying, this is how your kid did today.

Because somehow that paper to show them would magically disappear between the office and the car.

I don't know how it happened, but what that enabled.

Recycling

recycling.

There you go.

These kids really, really cared about the environment.

So what was so amazing is that when we started doing this, that doesn't mean that the parents read these all the time, but the kid, and we knew that.

The parent was gonna get this and it was there.

And so it increased communication.

It gave them an opportunity to reply to us, uh, right away with any issues that came up.

And we could talk through things very quickly instead of, yeah, let's schedule a meeting for next week.

Uh, these, these systems that we put in place made it so that the communication was that much better.

And that's what really was able to change our school.

Not just that we were working hard with these kids, which we were anyway.

But the work was actually meaningful and was a system that made it possible for us to do our best work every single day, and those systems are super important.

That's right.

I really liked what you said about focusing on the process, right?

It's the inputs that we have control over and not the outcomes.

My little drawing just had to do with, um.

Okay.

You know, knowledge known for a test, right?

You could see that where my finger is, there's just like three dots and they're kind of all talking to each other.

And then the other side says, knowledge, you know, needed, um, for life.

And there's just a lot more going on.

Right.

And

Yeah,

what it's about.

so my picture was a, uh, was a, what's it called?

Assembly line.

Then there's inputs where all the people are and outputs, and nobody's paying attention to the outputs because they're just taking care of themselves.

Their work is all on the, on the inputs over on the side.

Yeah.

Makes sense.

Okay, next one.

The status quo is the safe path forward.

That is the pre premise that we reject and, uh.

The, the new premise, this is the one that I love from you.

Ruckus makers are time travelers.

They see the future and tell everyone else about it.

Um, and one of the things that we have to recognize is that the system that we have is designed for exactly the results that we're getting.

And we do not think about that enough because, uh.

We just think, oh, I can't do anything about this.

But the reality is that our system was designed specifically to get this outcome.

That's why we're getting the outcome.

So if we want to change the outcome, then let's work on changing our system and making it different from what, what it has been.

Um, and, and the thing that I like about this is that every time you're frustrated or something isn't working right, that is a clear signal.

It's like a bat signal.

You can change this even if you don't think you can.

I, I promise you, you can change it in some way, shape or form, whether that's your own attitude towards it or actually making a difference and a change in, in what is going on.

And so if you see something that you don't like, then make the changes and, and that's exactly what needs to happen.

You look in the future and say, what do I want?

And then work to make that happen.

And it's not easy, but it is very simple.

Hmm.

Yeah.

When it comes to the, the status quo, I say that play it safe principles, right?

They pro, they protect that probably 'cause the status quo is safe.

We know how to do it.

There's books and literature and manuals and like how to operate the school this way.

why when I talk about the opposite of played safe principles, ruckus makers, I do say there are visitors from the future showing us how education can one day be.

And the future of education.

There's no manual, right?

So it requires leadership and innovation.

You know, there's a, there's a story about these, um, two business owners.

They're at a conference and they're just talking about, you know, what works, what doesn't work, how to grow, your business type of thing.

And, uh, they get to the topic of like their staff and how they're supported, right?

And developed.

this one business owner.

Puts a tremendous amount of resources into his people and the other, you know, his colleague he's talking to at the event is like, well, aren't you worried you're gonna invest so much in those people?

And then they leave, they go for greener pastures and then different organization.

He said, no.

What keeps me up at night is if I, uh, don't invest in my people and they stay.

That's, that's exactly the same thing when it

Yes.

and the status quo, right?

change, it's scary because in, in some respects, you don't know what's gonna happen next, but that's also a bit exciting.

I think what's scarier is like not.

Changing, not evolving, taking risks at times, and, uh, seeing how we can evolve, like if we stayed the same forever.

What a boring, terrible, lack of imaginative experience, right?

For education and everybody involved.

yeah, status quo isn't safe at all.

It's the riskiest thing you can do.

Yeah, I, I agree.

You know, the, the idea of, um, there not being a manual for the future, uh, is some people see that as scary.

I actually see that as freeing because you get to write the manual.

You get to say, this is what the future's going to look like.

And we all have that capacity and we can all predict the future to a certain extent because we can say, I'm going to do these things, and these things will result in positive results or results period.

Uh, but just sitting around doing the same old thing that you've done for the last 20 years, uh, is not going to be benefiting anyone.

It's not going to be helping you, uh, improve your school in any way.

Uh, the picture that I have for this one is, is just somebody picking up trash.

Okay.

if you, if you think that it's really a problem, then you just need to do something about it.

So I, I drew this because at my first school where I was assistant principal, um, there was, there was this issue where kids would just leave stuff around and.

Mm-hmm.

The principal wanted to like lecture the kids and say, you guys have to clean up.

And, um,

That worked.

and yeah, that didn't, and so I, I, being the assistant principal was the one to implement that job and it sucked.

And so, uh, I,

you wag your finger?

Because if you didn't wag your

I did, I, I wagged my finger and I was like, you kids need to do this and you need to pick up your trash and clean up the, uh.

Clean up the cafeteria and it was terrible.

And, and everybody hated it.

Nobody liked it.

And then this one teacher, she goes, uh, I'm just gonna start cleaning up.

And she just started cleaning up and as soon as she started cleaning up, another teacher was like, I guess I could help clean up.

So she started cleaning up and, and then the kids were like, oh, we could clean up too.

And, and everybody thought these poor Title one kids.

Didn't know how to clean up, didn't know how to take care of things, didn't care about anything.

And so then the kids started cleaning up also, and me wagging my finger, did nothing but the teachers saying, I want this school to be better.

I'm gonna start doing this.

And what they started doing is they started picking up trash in the halls outside on the playground.

One teacher when she was on, uh, playground duty, she was just, her playground duty was just walking around, picking up trash, and then kids would follow her and be like, can I pick up trash too?

She'd be like, of course.

And she'd have a bag and then kids would be surrounding her just picking up trash out in the field where we were at, there was a big field and there was a train track next to it, and so.

There was a lot of debris that would come off of, off of that.

And, and so we always had trash.

It wasn't ours, but she just wanted it to be a better place.

She took the initiative and did something about it and people followed and, and that's what it's like to be a remaker is that you, you do something and people are like, I want that too.

And then they start doing it.

And so that's why my picture is just somebody picking up trash.

'cause it's very simple, but it does make a difference.

It's lecturing versus modeling, lecturing versus doing, you know, uh, be the change you wanna see in the world.

Right?

Is that Gandhi and, uh, Derek Siver, Ted

Mm-hmm.

How to start a movement.

You're just the first guy dancing, and then there's two and three, and then it's a whole.

You know, field full of people dancing.

So, you know, that's, that's part of, uh, what we're talking about here.

I think the other thing, you know, with this status quo, and you, you, you mentioned how it could be scary, like, oh, there's no manuals, and, and you said that's freeing.

Right?

The other, the other thing I really want to double click on here for the ruckus maker enjoying this content is that, um, makes you irreplaceable if you're willing to.

Go on the reject the premise.

Do school a different journey with us because all, all the jobs that are at risk, right, of being disrupted and, uh, absolutely, you know, eliminated by ai, that's because there's a manual for how to do it.

AI needs context in order to, uh, make some guesses and that kind of stuff, but it can't create like net new things without us still.

At least for now.

So the only way to actually have security and safety is to leap into the unknown and create net new value and to create the future right now, today, right?

Because if, if it's already been done, can do it, but faster and cheaper if it hasn't been done.

where humans really can shine.

And so that's an interesting.

Tension, right.

That education's being forced to with right now.

And one of the things I've been saying about AI for months is if the computer can actually do the job better than an, than a person can, it's.

It's ridiculous to have the person do that work.

And that's where the work of leadership, the work of leading schools, has to be unique and developed for the people that are right there in front of you.

Um, that's what my book School X is all about is that it's about designing your school for the people that are right there in front of you.

And you have to do that because the people that are there in front of you are unique.

And they need things that not everybody else needs.

And if you're not willing to do that, then they're gonna go find someplace else to do it and someplace else will do it.

And there are a lot of people who are working on making, uh, ai, uh, solutions for a lot of the work that we do in schools.

And the reality is, is that the human aspect, the creative aspect, can't be replicated yet.

It can look like it, but it's not quite, there Can't create something new yet.

Maybe it never will.

We don't know that yet.

But it right now, certainly you have to be that creative force.

You have to be that unique force that's doing things.

So, um, alright, well that's, that's all I got for today.

Anything you want to say before we close?

No, it's been fun.

I know we got some more to still, uh, record, but we'll keep rocking and rolling with it.

And, you know, ruckus makers reject the promise, so.

We got a lot.

This is, these are my note cards, man.

This is the stack of what's left.

So we still got, we got plenty to go through.

So plus more that we'll,

if a dog ate my note cards.

I don't have that

ah,

well that's fun.

Good times.

It is fun and uh, I'll tell you this, just the way I'm built, but you know, I'll talk on any topic, so

That's right.

good.

We got this.

Alright, next.

Next reject The premise is gonna be on Danny Show Better Leaders, better Schools.

Make sure you're following along on that one and continue following along on this one.

For other great interviews and a continuation of this.

We're probably gonna get to like 50 episodes of this when we're done.

Who knows, man.

We should have started a whole new

Yeah, no kidding.

Well, we still could actually, maybe we should do that.

No, we'll see.

Okay.

Well, we actually are gonna do that because I'm gonna put all of these from your show and my show, we'll still do the same thing.

We'll still put 'em on ours, but we're gonna have another feed that is just reject the premise and then we'll just multicast on that one.

Multicast.

I've got the podcast network, I can have as many shows in there as I want.

So, um, I've got like 60 shows in my account right now, which is, uh, pretty wild.

And so anytime somebody's like,

more than me.

Hey, I got an idea for a show.

I'm like, well, let's run with it and try it and see how it goes.

Yeah.

'cause there's, there's so much good stuff out there.

So.

All right, I'm gonna work on that.

We will have a new, we'll have a new podcast up and running by the time this is out, so, all right.

Thanks Danny.

Alright.

You bet.